Try This at Home

Design your summer.

Here’s the quotation that originally inspired this idea:

Every man makes his own summer. The season has no character of its own, unless one is a farmer with a professional concern for the weather. Circumstances have not allowed me to make a good summer for myself this year…My summer has been overcast by my own heaviness of spirit. I have not had any adventures, and adventures are what make a summer.
— Robertson Davies, “Three Worlds, Three Summers,” The Enthusiasms of Robertson Davies (Amazon)

We mention the “What’s Your Neglected Sense?” quiz.

Here’s the color that Elizabeth suggested for me to search for during my visits to the Met.

Happiness Hack

A food scientist suggests that for a flavor that interests you — such as coffee, wine, vanilla, orange juice — do an online search for “sensory + lexicon” to help you find the words to describe it.

I consulted these lexicons when I was working on Life in Five Senses.

I mention Le Nez du Cafe/Whiskey/Wine.

Interview: Sarah LaFleur

We talked to Sarah LaFleur, the founder and CEO of the women’s clothing brand MMLaFleur.

Elizabeth mentions an episode of the How I Built This podcast when Sarah LaFleur was a guest.

We talked about the joy of dressing, the pleasures of texture, how people’s clothing choices have changed post-covid, and more.

Sarah LaFleur’s Try This at Home: Instead of planning a Date Night, plan a Date Morning.

Demerits & Gold Stars

• Gretchen’s Demerit: I forgot to go on my April New York City adventure – one of the items on my “23 in 23” list.
• Elizabeth’s Gold Star: She gives a gold star to the many Hollywood unions who are supporting the WGA strike.

Resources

If you’d like a collection of Proverbs of the Professions from teachers, you can download it here for free.

What we’re reading

• Elizabeth: The Nightingale by Kristin Hannah (Amazon, Bookshop)
• Gretchen: The Glen Rock Book of the Dead  by Marion Winik (Amazon)

Quotation

I read a quotation from Virginia Woolf’s diary:

But I must remember to write about my clothes next time I have an impulse to write. My love of clothes interests me profoundly: only it is not love; & what it is I must discover.

431

[Music]

Gretchen

Hello and welcome to Happier. A podcast where we talk about strategies and solutions for building happier, healthier, more creative and more productive lives. This week we’ll talk about Design Your Summer 2023 edition, and we’ll interview Sarah LaFleur, the founder and CEO of the women’s clothing brand M.M. LaFleur to talk about clothing, the joy of clothing and the Five Senses.

Gretchen

I’m Gretchen Rubin, a writer who studies happiness, good habits, the five senses, Human nature. I’m in New York City, and joining me today from Los Angeles is my sister, Elizabeth Craft. And Elizabeth, I’m so disappointed we’re not together. We thought we would be together today for this recording, but it didn’t work out.

Elizabeth

Yes, that’s me. Elizabeth Craft, a TV writer and producer living in L.A. And yes, Gretch. I ended up not being able to make my trip to New York, but I’m coming in a few weeks. So we will be together then.

Gretchen

Yes, at last.

Elizabeth

We will have lunch at a department store. 

Gretchen

Department store, lunch and other sisterly adventures. Yes, I cannot wait a few updates before we launch in. First of all, we are going to be doing the Happiness Podcast Book Club in episode 432. Big surprise we’re doing Life in Five Senses. We’ve gotten a lot of good questions and comments, so keep them coming. We want to have a lot of listener questions.

Gretchen

And Elizabeth, I’m very much looking forward to you interviewing me. I wonder what more do we have to say, but we’ll find more. Yes. Also, we are collecting examples of everyday luxuries. I don’t know about you, Elizabeth, but I find this endlessly fascinating and absolutely like you gave me a lotion warmer for Christmas, which seemed like the most indulgent thing, but I absolutely love it.

Gretchen

It really is. It’s something that I really do perceive as a luxury and really look forward to and feel like it’s a massive indulgence. Someone said frothy milk. It’s kind of like having something monogrammed. It feels very elevated when you have frothy milk. And once people point out these things as luxuries, I think we experience them as more luxurious.

Gretchen

So I’m gathering these up and we will talk about them in an upcoming episode. So send them in because we are gathering them.

Elizabeth

Yeah, Gretch. Also want to remind everyone that at the very end of the episodes after the credits, we have a little but.

Gretchen

Yes.

Elizabeth

Just a little extra something. Yeah. So if you don’t know about that, do listen to the end.

Gretchen

Yeah, I found out with what a podcast that I was listening to. I’m like, I’ve been missing this the whole time. I didn’t know they did this. I would have listened if I’d known, but okay, this week our try this at home suggestion is something that we’ve talked about for several years now in a row because it’s so helpful, which is the reminder to design your summer.

Elizabeth

Just saying that sounds fun Gretch. Just the words design your summer makes me in a good mood.

Gretchen

Yes, we’ve talked about this in episodes going all the way back to 27. I know we talked about it in 67, 118, 224, 276 and more. I mean, it was originally inspired by an observation by an author I love, Robertson Davies, in his essay Three Worlds, Three Summers. He wrote, “Every Man Makes his Own Summer.

Gretchen

The season has no character of its own unless one is a farmer with a professional concern for the weather. Circumstances have not allowed me to make a good summer for myself this year. My summer has been overcast by my own heaviness of spirit. I have not had any adventures and adventures are what make a summer.” And it seems like the summer can just fly by so quickly.

Gretchen

If we don’t think about, well, how can I make my summer feel like summer? For him, it was having adventures. It could be different things for different people. But you want to go into the season and think about what do we want from this season so that it doesn’t just slip by.

Elizabeth

And of course, Gretch, there’s no one way to design your summer. There’s so many different approaches you can take.

Gretchen

One thing that I think is super fun is you can have some of the five senses, so you could take the neglected sense quiz at gretchenrubin.com/quiz and plan something for your neglected sense. Maybe if you’re neglected sense is hearing you’d go with sound baths or if your neglected sense is  touch, you could do cryotherapy. Just something to have an adventure.

Gretchen

Or you could do something with your appreciated sense. So like if you loved taste, maybe you go to five new diners or you could just do five new hikes or five new parks. Because one of the things that research shows is that doing new things tends to make us happier. So if you push yourself to try new adventures, that’s probably going to make you happier.

Elizabeth

Yeah, I can imagine someone would, you know, do massage or a flower arranging class or a cooking class, just depending on what sense they want to tap into.

Gretchen

Right, yeah, because you want to do appreciated sense. You want to do neglected scents. You want to do something just because you heard of it. It sounds fun. One of my friends, speaking of the sense of sight, she had a Summer of Pink where she decided that she was only going to wear pink for the whole summer. And she did it, which I thought was really funny. I love that.

Gretchen

I don’t have enough clothes in any one color except if I had like the Summer of Black, which I don’t think sounds, that sounds a little hot. But listen, I have a suggestion that occurred to me yesterday was when I was at the Met. You have to play a role. Can I can I give you an assignment right now?

Gretchen

Yeah. Okay. So, you know, I love this sense of color and I wanted to bring that sense of color into my design. Your summer. So I want you to pick a color for me right now. And then throughout this summer, I’m going to be searching for this color throughout the Met, like in paintings, in ceramics. Where can I find this color?

Gretchen

So what color would you propose?

Elizabeth

I’m going to propose, Gretch, that you look for bright kelly grass green. You know, when grass is really, really green. Ultra green. That’s the color. Because I think that’s like a very summer color. Yes. And also I don’t think it’ll be that common. Fresh green grass.

Gretchen

Yes. Yeah. Oh, yes. I love that color. Okay. Well I think what I want you to do is go online, find a swatch of it. Okay. Because there are so many beautiful greens. Like is it the green of the dress that I wore when I was in Los Angeles? There’s that green. But maybe, maybe that’s a little bit too olive.

Gretchen

Maybe you’re thinking about something that’s a little brighter. Anyway, I want to get the right, the exact color.

Elizabeth

Yes, I’m thinking of more toward Kelly green. Okay. But I will find, I will find a picture.

Gretchen

Because I did that with the Pantone color and I had so much fun doing it, searching for a color. But it’s hard. So I think this will be a good, it might not take the entire summer, but it’s a good summer quest.

Elizabeth

Yes.

Gretchen

Okay.

Elizabeth

And Gretch, with our go outside 23 in 23, you going to have a summer of going outside, making a plan for spending more time outside. I think a lot of people want to do that in the summer.

Gretchen

Yeah. I know, just it feels like the right time. But again, it can slip by. You can think, oh, of course I’ll spend a lot of time hiking. But if you don’t go out of your way to design it into your everyday life. Oh, we’ll go to the botanical garden over and over throughout the summer, and then you just never end up doing it.

Gretchen

So it’s like, figure it out. Yeah.

Elizabeth

I love the idea of like having a summer of picnics where you’re going to do one or two picnics every week and that would get you outside. And also it just kind of shakes it up.

Gretchen

I love it. What is a more fun word than picnic? I love the idea of a picnic. Haven’t been on a picnic in so long. Okay, but here’s something I’m thinking about doing. So, you know, I go to the Met every day, but then sometimes I’m like, But it’s so beautiful outside. I hate to, like, give up that time to go indoors, you know, when it’s just so beautiful.

Gretchen

I’m sure you have this in Los Angeles where it’s so beautiful, you don’t want to go inside. I’m thinking that if it’s really beautiful outside, maybe I can go to the Central Park or the Met and then it’ll probably get so hot that I’ll want to go into the Met and not be in the park. But because a lot of times I can’t both go to Central Park and go to the Met.

Gretchen

Yeah. So I’m thinking maybe I will open that up so I won’t be going to the Met every single day the way I have been, but I will be going to Central Park.

Elizabeth

Well, I’m interested to see how this goes, Gretch, because with your upholder nature, it’s hard for you to change the rules, so.

Gretchen

That’s right.

Elizabeth

So I’ll be curious to hear if you go through with this.

Gretchen

Yes, that is exactly my problem, which is I’m like, can I give up the perfection of going to the Met every single day, even for something like enjoying the beautiful springtime. It’s very painful for me to change the rules.

Elizabeth

Okay. So tell me how that goes.

Gretchen

Okay, that’s an upholder.

Elizabeth

Well, Gretch for me. I will be outside a lot this summer because for me, it’s summer of the strike. I’m on strike and I will be picketing a lot, which is, of course, all outside. Yeah, that is my summer of being outside. But I’m calling it Summer of the Strike. And I’m hoping that it will not be fall of the strike as well.

Elizabeth

I’m hoping it’ll be over at some point this summer. Right.

Gretchen

Oh that’s interesting. Yeah. I didn’t think about the fact that it’s always outside obviously. So now you’re way surpassing your go outside 23 in 23. Yeah. Because you’re doing it for hours. Well I think my summer and I was going to do this last summer and then I didn’t, but I’m going to do summer rereading. There are certain books that I am so excited to reread, demanding books.

Gretchen

What I don’t like is the opportunity cost, because if I’m rereading this very demanding book like Elias Canetti, Crowds and Power, then there’s all these new books that I can’t read. But I really, really want to reread certain books, so I’m going to have, I’m finally circling back to my summer of rereading.

Elizabeth

Oh good, you will love that.

Gretchen

Well, let us know if you do try this at home and how you plan to design your summer. We can all learn from each other. It’s fascinating to hear what people do. Let us know on Instagram, TikTok, Twitter, Facebook. Drop us an email at podcastergretchenrubin.com. And as always, you can go to the show notes for this episode.

Gretchen

It’s happiercast.com/431 for everything related to this episode.

Elizabeth

Coming up we’ve got a hack that will help you tap into your taste sense. But first this break.

[Music]

Gretchen

And now for a happiness hack.

Elizabeth

Yes, this comes from Maia. She says, “I’m a food scientist and we use taste, smell, touch and sight when developing and testing a product with consumers. The aim is to delight in all the senses. But sound is a bit more nuanced with product testing. In sensory testing, we often get trained on a new set of, quote, lexicons. When you start working on a new category, those are sets of words that can be used to describe attributes of a product.

Elizabeth

Soup has a whole different lexicon than bakery or beverage. Sometimes just learning the words can help you describe something better, leading to more productive conversation of a group. Try googling sensory and lexicons for a flavor you’re interested in, like cinnamon or vanilla. You’ll be surprised at all the words you can use to describe it might prompt some more fun for taste.”

Elizabeth

What an amazing idea Gretchen. 

Gretchen

This is so fun. I mean, for both you and me, taste is our most neglected sense, and if people want to know their most neglected sense go to gretchenrubin.com/quiz. But this is really fun. I found lexicons for coffee, beer, chocolate, orange juice, tea. And it’s funny, like when you see these words, you do start to taste more specifically.

Gretchen

I saw that when I went to Flavor University, when I was writing Life in Five Senses, that when people offer you the vocabulary, you begin to be able to detect it much more easily.

Elizabeth

Yes. Yeah. And I think I always think of this with wine because people have all these words to describe wine, but I never thought about it with all these other tastes.

Gretchen

Yeah, right. You could look it up for ice cream because there are so many things. Yeah, but so here’s something that I did. This is expensive. So I’m just saying to people, this is expensive, but maybe as a gift or if there’s somebody in your life who really loves wine, whiskey or coffee, a listener told me about this website.

Gretchen

LeNez.com and its Nez like French NEZ. So it’s LeNez.com. And you can buy these really nice kits. They’re like wooden boxes that are full of different smells and all the different components of like, I got Nez de coffee. And so it’s all these coffee smells and it is so fun. I mean, I was like, I’m going to splurge on this because I am writing a book about Life in Five Senses.

Gretchen

Yes. Like Eleanor will do it with her friends. They’ll get out coffee and they’ll get out the box and they’ll smell it because it is really fun to do. So there was somebody in your life who’s super into whiskey. This can be something where it lets them enjoy that in a more nuanced, sophisticated way. But it’s still that delightful quality that she’s talking about because by having the lexicon, you actually become a more acute observer.

Gretchen

It really helps.

Elizabeth

You can take it to the next level.

Gretchen

Take it to the next level. So I’ll put a link to LeNez.com in the show notes. It’s really fun. And now for an interview with Sarah LaFleur. Sarah LaFleur is the founder and CEO of M.M. LaFleur, a women’s clothing brand. And Sarah and I recently did an event together at the M.M. LaFleur store here in New York City.

Gretchen

And she and I had so much fun talking about the five senses and clothing and stretchy fabrics and color that I thought, Oh, let’s have her on the podcast.

Elizabeth

In 2011, Sarah set out to launch a line of clothing for working women that would be simple, elegant and well tailored. She had no experience in fashion but partnered with a top line designer, Miyako Nakamura, to create M.M. LaFleur, which is now a multimillion dollar company. And Gretchen, I listened to a fascinating episode of the How I Built this podcast with Sarah, where she talked about the company, and it really just sort of drew me in.

Gretchen

Welcome, Sarah.

Elizabeth

Hi, Sarah.

Sarah LaFleur

Hi, Gretchen. Hi, Liz.  So great to be here.

Gretchen

We’re so happy to be talking to you.

Elizabeth

We are. Now, Sarah. You love to talk about the joy of dressing. What do you mean by that? And how do we keep it joyful?

Sarah LaFleur

Yeah, this is such a great question, because I do think, for the most part, getting dressed, especially for work settings, comes with a lot of angst. And in fact, there’s a statistic that we share with a lot of customers, which is that the average American woman takes two more weeks per year getting ready in the morning versus men.

Sarah LaFleur

Just kind of extraordinary, right? And you could say, oh, maybe she’s really having a great time with those two weeks. But yeah, I’m guessing that for a lot of women that time is wrapped up in angst and worry about whether they’re wearing the right outfit that day.

Gretchen

Whether their.

Sarah LaFleur

Hair looks exactly the way they want it to. And so I think it’s caught up in a lot of responsibility maybe that they’re feeling towards themselves or towards others. And so I think M.M LaFleur,  my company, is really all about trying to take back both the joy and the time. And what we say to customers is we want getting dressed in the morning to really feel like that joyful process where you’re saying, what do I want to feel like today?

Sarah LaFleur

Oh, I want to feel like, I’ll just you know, I’ll be honest this morning, my kids, I have three, two and a half year olds. They all have pink eye. And so they didn’t go to school. I was super stressed. I had a really big week of, I hosted a big event on Wednesday, so I was feeling wiped out when I heard my toddler yelling for me at 5:45 a.m..

Sarah LaFleur

And so I reached for this pink sweater that I’m wearing right now, and it’s a cotton boucle sweater. It’s super soft against my skin and it’s comforting. And I just as soon as I put it on, okay, maybe, maybe my number one feeling today isn’t joy. It’s actually kind of exhaustion, and how am I going to get through the day with these three kids who are not in school and all suffering from pinkeye and making sure I don’t get pink eye. But I’m wearing my sweater.

Sarah LaFleur

It makes me feel cozier, it makes me feel better. And I really do think it’s it’s possible if you if you organize your closet intentionally, if you if you think intentionally about the things that you’re you’re you’re buying and you’re putting on your body to really bring back joy and channel the feeling that you want to be feeling that day through your clothing.

Gretchen

Well, one of the things that really surprised me and I guess it wasn’t that surprising, but nevertheless did surprise me, which is that, you know, you can turn to your senses for comfort. And that’s the sense that people turn to. They turn to touch for comfort. And whether that’s like putting a dog or a cat or like I’m a hair twister and my husband is a head patter.

Gretchen

And we clearly do that to calm ourselves. And then some people like use fidget spinners or therapy dough and then like warm, cozy blankets and that kind of thing that are just comforting. And maybe that’s part of why you’ll have a special sweatshirt. Elizabeth, you and I are always talking about how we have these hoodies that are just right and everybody around us is like, Oh my gosh, please get rid of that hoodie.

Gretchen

But you’re like, Yeah, but it feels so good. It’s just the right amount of stretchy ness and weight. And it is, it’s the touch of it is comforting. So our clothes can give us that sense of comfort because it it is tapping into that sense.

Sarah LaFleur

100%. And Gretchen, you said this in your book yourself, you know, touches the only sense that we have all over our body, and I think it doesn’t matter how we get we we are all searching for comfort, especially in the world that we’re living right now. Yeah. And it’s just unfortunately no longer appropriate for us to walk around carrying around a teddy bear or a blanket.

Sarah LaFleur

And so clothes are, I really believe, it’s a close second. And we have one fabric group. It’s  Italian jersey. It’s made by this incredible family operated mill called Bardsey. And they make the softest jersey and it almost feels like pajamas. I mean, it is basically pajamas, but we released that as a suit. Actually, my doctor who is my IVF doctor, actually, Dr. Choi, she texted me Wednesday and she said, I’m off to California for a business trip.

Sarah LaFleur

And I put on these pants for the first time and, oh my God, I’ve never felt more comfortable in work pants. And I was like, that is exactly how I want you to feel, how I want people to feel when they wear our clothes.

Gretchen

Well, one of the things that surprised me when we were doing our event together the other night, so you took the neglected scents quiz and your most neglected sense was site, which I thought, you know, here you are, this clothing company. I thought that was surprising. But then in talking to you, you feel very much more focused on touch and also,  you’re not designing the clothes.

Gretchen

Were you surprised that that was your most neglected sense?

Sarah LaFleur

You know, it surprised me only in that I thought it was probably my most important sense professionally. Exactly. Professionally. And probably as a mom. I think it’s my probably or I think it’s my most used sense. And so that did surprise me. And at the same time, it did remind me it’s my co-founder, Miyako Nakamura.

Sarah LaFleur

You know, she is really the design talent behind our brand. She’s the chief creative officer and is really an artist. And so I think she sees clothing differently from I do. I’m much more focused on what we just talked about. I’m focused on how it feels because I’m really turning to it for comfort and I’m focused on machine washability and wrinkle resistance, and Miyako makes it look good.

Sarah LaFleur

And so that didn’t entirely, I think in after after thinking about it surprised me.

Elizabeth

That’s fascinating. Well, Sarah, what I’m wondering is, is how have people’s clothing choices changed post-COVID?

Sarah LaFleur

It has changed. I think if you were an alien who kind of dropped into Wall Street in 2023 versus 2019, I think you could you, would say, wow, women are dressing totally differently. I’m not sure about the men, but I think the women are dressing totally differently. And we really even see this reflected in our sales, you know, dresses and I would say like work dresses, for lack of a better term, a lot of kind of pencil skirt type dresses, 

Sarah LaFleur

They used to be 30% of our business. And then during COVID, it probably dropped to 12% of our business and it’s climbed back up. But it’s nowhere close to where it was. And what has really replaced it is jackets and pants, you know, and jackets, especially jacket sales have actually doubled from pre-COVID. And I think a lot of women, and I see this with myself, you know, I’m kind of flexing from one situation to another.

Sarah LaFleur

So I might you know, I might do a meeting from home in the morning and then I might drop my kids off at school and then I might run into the office. And so I’m kind of in multiple situations during the entire day. And the jacket allows me to flex really easily from saying, okay, I’m relaxed, I’m at home, or I’m with my kids, so I don’t care if it gets dirty, to

Sarah LaFleur

okay, let me throw my jacket on to I’m talking to a business colleague. I want to look like I showed up and I’m ready to go. And so that jacket is kind of this, like, all powerful signifier, I think, now. And it’s occupying this, like, new role in our wardrobe. And I don’t think it necessarily did before.

Gretchen

It’s like instant outfit.

Sarah LaFleur

It totally is, like it’s your superwoman cape, you know, I throw it on. I’m like, I’m ready for business.

Gretchen

Well, this is so funny because Elizabeth and her blazers.

Elizabeth

Yes, I went through this period of just wanting blazers and then I got all these blazers and I had a goal of wearing, you know, two blazers a week and then COVID hit. And I just completely had no use for these blazers. But now I’m starting to get them out again. And it’s great. It’s funny, Sara, I noticed that you have a category called Power Casual.

Elizabeth

I feel like that’s how I should dress. I’m a TV writer. Power casual just feels right for me. What would you call that? Is that the blazer and the pants?

Sarah LaFleur

For sure. I mean, you can certainly pull off a power casual look with dresses, but I think the most standard go to, and this is certainly, this is my Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday uniform now because that those are three days where I’m usually in the office or meeting people it is definitely the blazer with a little underpinning which could be a knit piece or even like a nice T-shirt and then and then pants.

Sarah LaFleur

And we really, I think, you know, I remember for New York, right. New York, which is where I live and which is where our company is based. And our return to outdoor life, I think was later than a lot of other parts of the country. But really last spring, we had a lot of customers just kind of running into our stores being like, I’m going back to the office I do not know what to wear.

Sarah LaFleur

Yeah, I do not know how to dress anymore. And then, you know, I’m speaking for myself. I put on weight like my old clothes no longer fit, like I need kind of a new way to dress. And what does that look like? And so we said power casual. That’s the way to do it. We call it one level, one step below business casual, but one step above truly casual.

Gretchen

Interesting. business casual, casual, and then it’s athleisure. Maybe it’s.

Sarah LaFleur

Exactly right. And I think a lot of women and we and again, like we see this in the numbers like athleisure, there is definitely a time and place for it. But I think a lot of our customers are saying, like, it’s not it is not actually what I’m going to be wearing Monday through Sunday. Right. So I love a good Lululemon align pant more than, you know, just as much as the next next woman that when you when you’re seeing people and when you want to show up for these different moments in your life you know talking about again like joy and and how can you show up for these moments.

Sarah LaFleur

I do think clothing is like a, it’s like, it’s just a tool in your in your toolkit. I think a lot of you know and you can you can do different things like some people want to give themselves a pep talk and some people want their hair to look a very certain way. And and there are different ways you can get yourself ready for that moment to show up.

Sarah LaFleur

But for me, my chosen kind of tool is clothing. And I think we’ve all experienced this moment, right? I mean, Halloween is even a good example. Like if you wear a costume, you suddenly almost feel like you could be a different person. It’s incredibly powerful. And my mom used to say to me, like, why does a doctor wear a white coat?

Sarah LaFleur

It’s not because it’s practical. It’s because when that person with the white coat walks into the room, you know, that’s the person you’re going to be listening to and you should be listening to.

Gretchen

When I was clerking. So I clerked for a judge on the Second Circuit and also for a Supreme Court justice. It was astonishing how they would seem transformed when they put on their robes. I mean, and I thought it was a really good thing. Like you should feel transformed. You should feel like you have a special responsibility.

Gretchen

It should feel different when you put on your robe. You are playing this role that is transcendent. But it was really like seeing it happen to somebody you knew right in front of you. It was bonkers.

Sarah LaFleur

I love that story. And I love that. Right. That’s the Superwoman Cape moment. And so 1% agree.

Elizabeth

I just love that. Now we can have clothes transform us but also be comfortable. And that’s the key.

Sarah LaFleur

Liz you’re spot on. I don’t think any of us want to go back to pants that kind of suck the air out of us. I mean, maybe some but I mean, I just think I think I don’t, I certainly don’t have the patience for it. And so pants are I’m sure you’ve noticed like they’re getting looser again like skinny pants are.

Sarah LaFleur

I don’t want to say they’re on their way out because I think actually what’s happening is there’s just more variety now and kind of a lot of things go every, you know, and it’s not one or the other, but the elastic waistband, like we have these pants called the Kolby pants, the Kolby. And they look like they aren’t they look like, you know, kind of nice trousers, but they have an elastic waistband and they are they are one of our best selling pants.

Sarah LaFleur

And they they were doing it. They were they were great pants before the pandemic, but post-pandemic, their sales have skyrocketed and I think for good reason. And then heels, I just don’t see a lot of women going back to heels like they’re there’s a moment for them and people still love wearing them, but it’s not really kind of the the everyday go to the way I think it was pre-pandemic.

Gretchen

It’s funny my husband Jamie and I have been watching Better Call Saul and one of the characters is an associate in a law firm. And I just like, I cannot take my eyes away from her heels because I’m like, you’ve got to get out of those heels. And like every minute she can take them off, of course she’s taking them off.

Gretchen

So you realize how uncomfortable they are. It’s hilarious. Okay. But Sarah, before we let you go, we need to ask you, what is your try this at home suggestion for listeners who want to try something to make themselves happier, healthier, and more productive or more creative.

Sarah LaFleur

So I’ve actually I’ve thought about this one and I have to say my biggest life hack recently that my husband and I have stumbled upon is the date morning.

Gretchen

So a twist on the on the traditional.

Sarah LaFleur

Yeah. I think you know we’ve got three young kids we can barely keep our eyes open past 930 and you know, we were like, god, we really got to go to go on date night like we should. We should book we should book something. We should go. And at some point I was like, Why are we forcing ourselves to try something?

Sarah LaFleur

Actually, neither of us particularly excited to do it. And so rather than getting a babysitter for a weekday night, which is what we used to do, we now ask someone to come on Saturday morning and we leave the house, you know, around eight. We, we go for a coffee and a pastry somewhere, and then we go and explore a new neighborhood in New York.

Sarah LaFleur

And we live in Brooklyn now. So, like, every different neighborhood feels like you’re almost visiting a different city. And so we might just to go to like a local restaurant for lunch and just explore and walk around a little bit. But two great things have happened. One is that we managed to stay awake for this, and the second one is we’re actually we’re seeing each other out in the daytime and it’s it just feels fresh because it, you know, Monday through Friday, it’s really it’s rare for us to see each other in broad daylight and so it’s you know, it’s a new thing.

Sarah LaFleur

We’re trying we don’t do it every weekend, but we really enjoyed it. And we try to we try to schedule it when we can.

Gretchen

That’s great. Well, thank you so much, Sarah. It’s been great to talk to you. Have a great date.

Sarah LaFleur

morning when it rolls around. Thanks, Gretchen. Thanks, Liz.

Elizabeth

Coming up, Gretchen gives herself a New York City demerit. But first, this break. Okay, Gretch, it’s time for demerits and gold stars, and you’re up this week with a happiness demerit.

[Music]

Gretchen

Okay, this is a 23 in 23 demerit. So, you know, I had my monthly adventures, so I went on the ferry to Red Hook, and I went to Sunnyside in Queens. And then for April, I just 1% forgot about it. Did not think about it one time. Realize that it was May. And then all of a sudden and I was thinking, Oh, you know, I kind of like to go to Green-Wood Cemetery.

Gretchen

And then I thought, Oh my gosh, I forgot. I completely never once crossed my mind. This is why I need to keep looking at the list, because I don’t remind myself of it. I just forget that I’ve decided to do something. Or if I don’t schedule it, put it like actually put it in the calendar. Like, here’s a good place to do one of my adventures.

Gretchen

So anyway, I just 1% forgot. And now, by the way, we’re well, well, well into May, and I haven’t done my events, so I need to get that.

Elizabeth

Yes, well, I give you a pass because your book came out and I think you were very preoccupied. But you want to keep it up.

Gretchen

I want to keep it up. And how about you, Elizabeth? What is your gold star? 

Elizabeth

Gretch, I am giving a gold star to all of the other Hollywood unions who are supporting the WGA in our quest for a fair contract. We are getting so much support from my party from the DGA, from SAG, from the Teamsters. People are coming out on the picket line with their own signs for their union saying, you know, SAG supports the WGA, They’re in t-shirts .

Elizabeth

Trucks are turning around and not going into studios because they don’t want to cross picket lines. So we’re actually shutting down productions. I actually was picketing the other day at Disney, and I got teary from seeing all the people who were not WGA who were walking the picket line with us. It really just helps with morale to see how many people support us.

Elizabeth

That’s not always the case that unions support each other that way and it really is appreciated. I just want everybody to know that we appreciate it, we see it and I hope that our fight helps their fight.

Gretchen

Oh, that’s wonderful. I want to buy my strike T-shirt. So later on, we’re going to have to talk about which one is which is the best T-shirt, because I’m, definitely want my T-shirt. The resources for this week. If you want proverbs of the professions from teachers, because we’re coming up at the end of the school year, and that gets us all thinking about how grateful we are to teachers and how much wisdom they have to impart.

Gretchen

You can find that at gretchenrubin.com/resources. And if you have any more send them my way because I love proverbs of the professions. What are we reading, Elizabeth? What are you reading?

Elizabeth

I am listening to the Nightingale by Kristin Hannah.

Gretchen

I am reading the Glenn Rock Book of the Dead by Marion Winik. And that is it for this episode of Happier. Remember to try this at home design in your summer. Let us know what you’re doing to design your summer and how it’s working for you.

Elizabeth

Thanks to Sarah LaFleur of M.M. LaFleur, and thank you to our executive producer Chuck Reid and everyone at Canes 13. Get in touch. Gretchen’s on Instagram and TikTok at Gretchen Rubin, and I’m on Instagram at Liz Craft. Our email address is podcast@gretchenrubin.com.

Gretchen

And if you like this show, you know what to do. I’m not even going to say it.

Elizabeth

Until next week. I’m Elizabeth Craft.

Gretchen

I’m Gretchen Rubin. Thanks for joining us. Onward and upward.

[Music]

Gretchen

So, Elizabeth, talking to Sarah made me think of one of the most kind of mysterious lines from Virginia Woolf’s diary that I’ve always kind of been haunted by. She wrote, “But I must remember to write about my clothes next time I have an impulse to write. My love of clothes interests me profoundly. Only it is not love and what it is I must discover.”

Elizabeth

It’s like, Oh wow.

Gretchen

What is it?

Elizabeth

Well, we all relate to that, though.

Gretchen

I think so. 

[Music]

From the Onward Project.